Queen Beatrix is abdicating

The Heraldry of Belgium, The Netherlands and Luxembourg
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Jeremy Kudlick
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Queen Beatrix is abdicating

Postby Jeremy Kudlick » 29 Jan 2013, 10:56

She has announced that she will pass the crown to Willem-Alexander on April30. http://www.cnn.com/2013/01/28/world/dut ... ml?c=world
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Jonathan Webster
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Re: Queen Beatrix is abdicating

Postby Jonathan Webster » 29 Jan 2013, 12:43

Which invites the question as to what the heraldic repercussions of the abdication will be. Obviously, Willem-Alexander will adopt on his accession the Arms of Dominion previously borne by his mother, and HM Queen Beatrix will presumably, as her mother did before her, re-adopt the arms she previously bore as Princess, but what about the daughters of Willem-Alexander? Does anyone know if any official pronouncement has been made as regards any of this?

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Re: Queen Beatrix is abdicating

Postby Ryan Shuflin » 29 Jan 2013, 16:28

I believe his oldest daughter becomes Princess of Orange and quarters the Royal arms with the arms of Orange. I don't think the arms of the younger daughters change.

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Re: Queen Beatrix is abdicating

Postby steven harris » 29 Jan 2013, 19:00

Do Dutch men derive precedence from their wives?

When Willem-Alexander takes the throne, his eldest daughter (now aged 9) will become “Princess of Orange” as heir-apparent. If she should marry while he father is still King, would her husband assume the title “Prince of Orange”?
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Re: Queen Beatrix is abdicating

Postby Ryan Shuflin » 30 Jan 2013, 15:56

Interestingly, since 1890 only Queens have reigned in the Netherlands and had no Prince of Orange since 1884. Male-preference was abolished in 1983, during the reign of the first Queen to have a male child and he is also the oldest. So they changed the law at a time when it wouldn't matter.

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Re: Queen Beatrix is abdicating

Postby Jonathan Webster » 30 Jan 2013, 16:51

As likewise, did Denmark.

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Ton de Witte
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Re: Queen Beatrix is abdicating

Postby Ton de Witte » 30 Jan 2013, 19:30

Ryan Shuflin wrote:Interestingly, since 1890 only Queens have reigned in the Netherlands and had no Prince of Orange since 1884. Male-preference was abolished in 1983, during the reign of the first Queen to have a male child and he is also the oldest. So they changed the law at a time when it wouldn't matter.


I remember that there was some sort of directive from the european commision or some party in that vain about that sort of discrimination so it had to be changed sometime.
1983 was not a random chosen time because in 1983 the entire Dutch constitution was revised. In the new constitution a provision was made for the nobility i.a. that there would have to be created a new law regarding nobility. The result of this law is that no new nobles have been created (with one exception for the 2nd son of the queen and some other royal relatives), a situation which had existed since the last enoblement in 1939.
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Re: Queen Beatrix is abdicating

Postby Ton de Witte » 30 Jan 2013, 19:35

Ryan Shuflin wrote:I believe his oldest daughter becomes Princess of Orange and quarters the Royal arms with the arms of Orange. I don't think the arms of the younger daughters change.


This is not correct the crown prince never quartered his arms with those of Orange when he became the Prins van Oranje, these arms were already in his arms and also they are already in the arms of his daugthers in the 2nd and 3rd quarters.
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Re: Queen Beatrix is abdicating

Postby Jonathan Webster » 05 Feb 2013, 03:05

steven harris wrote:Do Dutch men derive precedence from their wives?

When Willem-Alexander takes the throne, his eldest daughter (now aged 9) will become “Princess of Orange” as heir-apparent. If she should marry while he father is still King, would her husband assume the title “Prince of Orange”?


-I'm not sure, but I doubt it. Bearing in mind that the title 'Prince of Orange' would be the correct title to be given to a male Dutch Heir Apparent, I wouldn't imagine they'd give it to the husband of a female heir apparent because there are any number of scenarios that could thus result in there being two Princes of Orange (e.g. Catharine-Amalia dies before her father but leaves a son; in which case both the son and his father would bear the same title, or Catherine-Amalia dies after her marriage but before her father but without issue, as do both of her sisters, but her father goes on to have a son later on who subsequently becomes Prince of Orange, just like his brother-in-law.) Yes; not very likely, but still possible (and all equally applicable to the title 'Prince of Wales' in the UK too.) Yes; there is the example in Sweden of the husband of a female Heir-Apparent sharing his wife's title, but the ducal titles given to the members of the Swedish Royal family are not hereditary and there is no title that has been granted specifically on a consistent basis to the Heir Apparent, which is the opposite case as regards the titles 'Prince of Wales' and 'Prince of Orange'.

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Re: Queen Beatrix is abdicating

Postby Ton de Witte » 05 Feb 2013, 08:54

No men do not derive titles from their wives in the Netherlands.
And a bit of trivia there are in fact at the moment 3 Princes of Orange , one is the crown prince, the second is the head of the house of Hohenzollern and the third one is the head of a French family.
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